The Value of the Mass

The Value of the Mass
Up to our own times, it has been the constant concern of supreme pontiffs to ensure that the Church of Christ offers a worthy ritual to the Divine Majesty, 'to the praise and glory of His name,' and 'to the benefit of all His Holy Church - Pope Benedict XVI, Summorum Pontificum

Saturday, December 1, 2007

Back From Thanksgiving (for a while)

Well, it's been a while since I've gotten back from Thanksgiving. I figure I would post about it. I don't think it's any secret now that I've been visiting the seminary for the FSSP in Denton. Thanksgiving made my second trip. I have to say that that seminary is absolutely wonderful. What a place of prayer. Absolutely everything revolves around Christ. The seminarians lives are so filled with inner joy that it's indescribable. Unlike the Josephinum, where seminarians seem to have nothing but contempt for everything they do, the seminarians in Denton know exactly why they're there. Prayer proceeds everything and life is structured to where the seminarians lives revolve around the seminary life and the seminary life revolves around Christ and his church. It was also nice to see priests teaching the classes. The interaction between the priests and the students was a lot different than what I was used to. The seminarians really trust the priests they have contact with. There is great honor given to the sacred priesthood there and thus great honor and trust is given to every individual priest.

I've spent a total of 3 weeks (my first trip and my most recent) with the Fraternity and I absolutely love it. I only hope my application process goes well. I'll leave that one up to God though. Boy, discernment can be difficult.

As for the trip itself, it went wonderful. For anybody who's wondering, the trip from Columbus to Denton is 17 hours one way. On our way back, we stayed in Chicago with the Institute of Christ the King Sovereign Priest (see link to side). They were very hospitable and even the short time we stayed with them was very tranquil. The brothers and priest there showed nothing but kindness and hospitality to us.

We also got a chance to go to downtown Chicago. For those of you who have never been to Chicago, it's wonderful and worth the trip. The pizza alone is worth the trip. I would suggest the place near the base of the Sears tower with the famous stuffed pizza. For the life of me, I can't remember the name of that place, but it's gooooooooood! I would also recommend going to the top of the Sears tower. What a view! It's was absolutely awesome! It's also $22 so be prepared.

When leaving we visited St. John Cantius church. It's right outside of downtown and is absolutely breathtaking! Unfortunately we only saw the church (like that's unfortunate!) and didn't get a chance to talk to the brothers or stay there for a Mass.

Lastly, on this trip I'm only left with this last advice... don't go to Toledo. Worst part of the trip!


viking said...

I would consider 12$ for a pizza cheap. You have been tagged.

Zach said...

oops, that should read $22. Typo. I'll correct it shortly.

a thorn in the pew said...

I keep praying for you. 17 hours.....eesh. Glad your trip went well and God bless.

A Simple Sinner said...

"Unlike the Josephinum, where seminarians seem to have nothing but contempt for everything they do, the seminarians in Denton know exactly why they're there."

I like this blog well enough I do, but writing stuff like that - even if it is true sound bitter and petty.

Don't put that out there for public consumption - it serves no good end. It will lead to no changes or reforms. It will not help your brothers, it will get your opinions dismissed. It will dishearten the faithful and confirm the cynical.

This is one ex-seminarian to another. If I wanted to trash mine I could do it up and down the blogosphere in a half dozen fora, and I have notes. I don't want to do that, it would acccomplish nothing. Actually it would accomplish something, and that something is anger and despair. I don't want to have to answer for that.

We are of like minds on a lot of issues.

But find the good and praise it. That doesn't mean your an ostrich or Polyanna, but there are a lot of people out there that need to know about the GOOD things. Where I grew up, it was AWFUL. If I would have known about the good things out there, I would have felt less despair and more hope.

Holy Family is producing vocations to beat the band, some of the guys that are persisting at the Josephinum are hitting the ground runing, and situations are improving. The FSSP is growing, the Wyoming Carmelites, the Sisters of Life, the Congregation of Saint John, the Norbertines in Orange County, the Dominican sisters in Ann Arbor, the Dominican sisters in Nashville, the EWTN Franciscans, the Sisters of Life, the Midwestern province of the Dominicans, and on and on.

This is friendly and free advice - don't trash the Josh (even if you are right) highlight and praise OLGS and blog about what is good and what is edifying. That is the tact we have taken at our blog, and our readership is growing weekly. We get private emails letting us know how happy people are to hear about these new and growing or orders as well as the reforming ones.

Everyone knows how bad it is. How many know of what offers us hope.

Tell them.

Zach said...

Although I respect your opinion, I have to disagree. I'm supprised that you pulled that one comment about the Josephinum out of this overly positive and optimistic post. I was just making a brief comment about my experence at the Josephinum and went into no kind of detail about it.

I do disagree with your philosophy about the matter though. I think it is more important to instruct the faithful about the bad and, honestly, scandalous seminaries that exist in the Church today. It would be like a father not telling his child that the stove is hot but letting the child burn himself. If seminarians wish to "hit the ground running" in such a situation, they should at least know what kind of ground they stand on first.

A Simple Sinner said...

Would that it were so simple.

Spreading the internal problems about the Josh and effectively trashing it does no good. It does not dissuade the young men who will be sent there by the choice of their bishops, it does not reform the place.

Billions of souls remain unreached and no matter what you do, no amount of pontification changes that. There is much work to do, to be sure... This is not work that advances anything.

I know that you have readers among the seminarians at the Josephinum among the student body. Among the administration I, don't know. But who in power that could change things would read this and think it anything but the ignorable musings of someone they can dismiss as bitter and/or self-righteous?

We know how bad it is. Now point to where it is being fixed and lead the faithful to support them.

Have you considered going out to Newark to do a photo-documentary post on the Children of Mary? Did you take pictures in Denton to show the good that is going there?

Show what is good, and the lay reader can offer support to these groups - they can pray for them, they can visit, they can send money, they can help fill the pantries, they can join.

Trash the place that dismissed you, what can they do? NOT go there?

There is so much work to be done, write about where the work IS being done. Pray for your brother seminarians that they can persist unto the altar where real change can be effected.

Zach said...

It really surprises me that you're taking this one line comment about the Josephinum way out of proportion. I could have said quite a lot more about the things that go on there when I was dismissed.

You say that people know how bad the Josh (and other seminaries) are, but I sure didn't when I entered, and if I had I would never had signed up for the diocesan seminary program. If I were to divulge the situation at the Josephinum, which I should highlight that I have never done on this blog, it would be so that potential seminarians could make an informed decision.

You said, "Trash the place that dismissed you, what can they do? NOT go there?"

Well, I'd like to point out that I never "trashed" the Josephinum, I just made a statement about the mindset of the seminarians there. I have actually shown great restraint about what I could say about the Josephinum. As for people deciding not to go there, that's exactly what they can do. That would speak volumes! The dilemma is that problematic seminaries destroy vocations and, in some cases, peoples faith.

I do appreciate your suggestions to do positive posts. I have tried to do that, and will be doing some more posts about a revitalizing faith in the future. I think that the post about the Children of Mary in Newark would be a great thing. Also, to answer you, I did get pictures of Denton when I was out there, but they didn't turn out very good and, frankly, the FSSP website has better pictures.